Gita: A Mantra for Success
Gita: A Mantra for Success
Episode 10: The Gunas_Chapter 13-18
In this episode, we explain the concept of the Gunas in detail.
- THREE KEY LESSONS from the Bhagavad Gita:
- What is higher knowledge?
- What is God?
- How do you find the inner peace?
- What are the three things that we must renounce for inner peace?
- Different examples of Gunas
- Gunas and Food
- Gunas and Charity
- Gunas and Happiness
- Gunas and Workers
- Gunas and Intelligence
- Krishna's Final Message to Arjuna (and everyone)
"I have now revealed to you this wisdom, which is the deepest mystery. After fully considering what you have heard, you should then act as you see fit.”
- BONUS: We discuss the movie GUIDE and narrate the story of Raju and his journey from a tourist guide to a fake spiritual guide to an enlightened soul.
What are the three Gunas - Sattvic, Rajas and Tamas?
Sadhguru says, "All the qualities of the world have been identified as three basic gunas, tamas, rajas, and sattva. Inertia is called tamas. Activity is called rajas. Transcendence is called sattva.
"There is no physical entity without all these three dimensions. Not a single atom is free of these three dimensions of a certain static nature, of energy, and of vibrance. If these three elements are not there, you cannot hold anything together – it will break up. If it is just sattva, you won't remain here for a moment – you will be gone. If it is just rajas, it’s not going to work. If it’s just tamas, you will be asleep all the time. So, these three qualities are present in everything. It is just a question of to what extent you mix these things."
Vee 00:04
Hello everybody, welcome to our podcast Gita a mantra for success.
Vee 00:14
So in our last episode, we basically talked about Bhakti. Krishna reveals his universal form or Vishwaroop, right. For some reason, many people believe that Gita ends here man is actually not true, right?
Dee 00:27
Yes. So let me quickly speak about how chapters 13 to 18 unfolds. Many scholars suggest that Bhagwad Gita can be divided into three divisions, chapter one to six - Krishna introduces the concept of Karma Yoga, Gyana Yoga and Dhyana Yoga. They more philosophical in nature. Absolutely.
Then from seven to 12, all about Bhakti. Now from chapters 13 to 18. Gita goes back to its philosophical or spiritual mode,
Vee 00:56
Right, and it actually almost looks like you know, Krishna finished his.. his big presentation. And then you have a question and answer session. Yeah.
Q & A session with Arjuna - Don't you agree?
Dee 01:08
Yeah, I agree. I agree. Let me make three points from these chapters before we move to gunas.
Vee 01:15
Perfect, perfect.
Dee 01:16
First point, there is a new description of knowledge here. Krishna has a very different take on knowledge. He's not talking about knowledge we derive from the books by reading or studying. He's like, no, I'm sorry. That's not really knowledge, knowledge. So instead, he's speaking about life transforming knowledge, okay. He says, when we know ourselves to be Atman or Brahman, then we do not live in the same way anymore, right?
We change our lifestyle, we create this mood of detachment and he calls that higher knowledge. So he gives some tips on how to attain that higher knowledge. You know, for example, avoiding pride and deceit, not harming others, patience, honesty, self control. We spoke about all this.
Vee 02:07
Yes, we spoke about all this, but it's a recap.
Dee 02:08
It's just a recap. Then there's a second point that I love - how he defines the presence of God within the world. He explains energy. And he gives example of you know how this energy comes from the sun. And that energy is the source of ..for all elements. And he even goes on describing different kinds of energy coming from not only from the sun, but also from the moon, how that energy nourishes all the plants. And he goes on describing how that energy helps humans.. even digest food, you know, survive and so on. He says that energy is God.
Vee 02:43
So are we talking about the force in Star Wars or Eywa in Avatar?
Dee 02:47
Yeah, something like that. Exactly. It goes back to that. Yes.
Vee 02:50
Makes sense?
Dee 02:51
He kind of says everything is connected, right. You know, he's saying that energy within us is somehow connected with the energy in the universe, right.
So as long as you're connected with this inner energy within you, right? You are kind of connected with the God because you know….
Vee 03:07
Exactly…I've always said that ..I've always said that and believed that and that's pretty much like we talked about the Force or Eywa. And yeah, you're basically making me happy, because that's what he says. And I've been saying that for years anyway. Move on to your third point.
Dee 03:19
Yeah yeah. So third point, he divides humans into two categories, okay, the Daiva or the Asura Sampad. So Daiva is I guess - Devas God and Asura is those Rakshyas so you know? So we're
Vee 03:36
Good and bad, good and bad, dark and light
Dee 03:39
Dark and light. So we are all born with some inherent character of this Daiva and Asura. It is actually something similar to the Yin and Yang philosophy. Okay, black and white.
I guess Daiva is all white. It is pure, fearless, truthful, honest, compassionate, you know, like all those absence of arrogance. Anger, you know All those good good pure qualities. And Asura is the opposite of Daiva. Deceit, arrogance, pride, anger, ignorance, these are all characters of Asura.
And he reminds us, if we can renounce three things, we become 100% Daiva and we attain liberation. Okay?
Just three things which I personally think is the toughest. And those three things are desire, anger and greed.
Vee 04:29
Hmm Makes sense …Make sense?
Dee 04:30
So I guess it's the time …right time to discuss Guna ..so go ahead. I know you love Gunas
Vee 04:34
Okay, sure. Sure. Let's go back to as we discussed in Episode Three.
Samkhya divides into two categories. Purusha, which is Atman or the soul. That is kind of unknown to us. You can't see it, you can't touch it right.
And then there is Prakriti or nature, which we see all around us and it's known to the humans right?
Now this Prakriti consists of three fundamental qualities or forces, which are actually called guns.
And they're broken down as Sattva, Rajas and Tamas. Okay, and so these three qualities are present everywhere
Dee 05:11
I get that every known thing in this world, both tangible and intangible – are mixture of these three gunas or three qualities, right?
Vee 05:20
Correct. Correct.
Dee 05:21
So, I guess let's first define these gunas. What is good Guna and what is bad Guna?
Vee 05:27
Okay, so let's go back to, you know, the good side and the dark side. Okay, I know I always go back to Star Wars, but it's easier to explain.
Okay, right. So it's the same with the gunas. Sattva is the good side. And it is associated with good things like you mentioned before. Purity, goodness, cleanliness, detachment, right.
And then we have Rajas. Rajas is not bad. Rajas is right in the middle. Right
And Rajas is ..because it's in the middle, it can swing to the left or the right.. meaning it can become good or it can become bad.
Dee 05:59
So undecided voters?
Vee 06:01
Something like that.. they are right in the middle. So Rajas is associated with passion, energy, active, which can be good, yes. Right.
And but it can also be associated with confusion or self doubt, which is bad. So they're almost leaning towards dark, but if you pull it and you know their confusion ..if you clear it, then it will come on the Sattvic side. So they are right in the middle, okay.
Now Tamas on the other hand, it is definitely the dark side, okay. And it is associated with darkness, sloth, which is kind of like laziness, destruction, chaotic indulgence, dirtiness – things like that, right?
Dee 06:38
So I guess it makes sense to give some examples. Do you have any case studies or stories?
Vee 06:45
Case studied huh….Blogs, case studies, okay. Sure.
Actually, there are a lot of examples in chapter 17 that Krishna gives, you know, on pretty much how you should live your life starting with how you should eat, how you should act, you know, pretty much things like that. There are steps for..
Dee 07:01
so let's start with the food.
Vee 07:03
Oh, easiest one. Yeah, let's start with the food. So even with food, they can be categorized into these three categories. Sattvic kind, Rajasic kind and the Tamasic kind of food. Okay, so sattvic food are basically things you know, food that brings us like long life, strength, good for your health. You know, for vigor… pretty much all the green stuff protein. Again, this good protein, bad protein. Again we are talking about the good stuff …. anything that makes you healthy. Pretty, right? That's all a sattvic food.
Now rajasic food on the other hand are things that are more like bitter, salty, very hot, spicy, tasting, spicy. Burning. So not so healthy food.
Tamasic food on the other hand, like you know, stale, tasteless, rotten, leftover stuff, dirty, foul.
So basically what we have here is …in this time when he's talking about the food, Krishna becomes the fitness guru. He basically condemns anything excessive, which makes sense.
Dee 08:06
Which makes sense. Yeah.
Vee 08:07
Like in the old days, Yogi's would renounce everything. And they would literally kill themselves by not eating for days, starving themselves and that basically harms your body.
Dee 08:15
Yeah yeah …there's a story about Buddha as well about how you should treat your body. In the beginning, when Siddhartha ..
Vee 08:24
Before he became Buddha, right
Dee 08:25
Yes..when he believed ..he believed that he must undergo terrible penances to attain Nirvana. And so he deprived himself of food until he became so frail and so fragile and, you know, he almost died.
One day a milkmaid offered him a bowl of milk and he drank it. Then he ate some food and begin to feel healthy again. Okay, so it became clear to Siddharth that extreme physical punishment would not lead to liberation. He realized that neither the pleasures of life nor the physical suffering, offered him The Wisdom he was seeking at that time,
That goes along with Krishna’s teaching. So yeah
I have another question for you. How should we be at work?
Vee 09:10
So Krishna basically talks about how Yajna should be performed. And at that time, that was their job. So let's link that with job. Sattvic workers are free from, you know, ego and selfish attachments, and they're full of enthusiasm. And in both success and failure, like we talked about Karma Yogis… they're balanced, right, that is those are Sattvic workers.
Rajasic workers have strong personal desires and actually crave towards their action. They want to do something but they are easily swept away by Fortune - good or bad. Okay, right. So again, they're in the middle. They could be pulled to the good side or
Dee 09:49
Bad side…
Vee 09:50
Tamasic workers, on the other hand, are lazy, undisciplined, stubborn and dishonest. Right. They are easily depressed and they're prone to procrastination. So they're always pushing off stuff. And they're always complaining and whining.
Dee 10:07
So what about charity and austerities? I know Krishna talks about that as well.
Vee10:11
Right? So in the Bhagwad Gita context, he's basically talking about Yogi's doing Tapasya, austerity, things like that. Yes.
But in today's context, let's talk about .. nonprofit or any charitable trust ..When you want to help others. without desiring any result, like we talked about Karma Yoga, then that is Sattvic nature
Dee 10:38
Of course, that is Karma Yoga.
Vee 10:39
But when the you know, the austerity is taken for the sake of respect, or fitting into the society, hypocrisy
Dee 10:48
Of course, which happens
Vee 10:49
Then it becomes Rajas. You have a nonprofit and you don't really care about the cause. You're actually stealing from people. You're basically saying, Yeah, this is for the poor, but you don't really care about them and you just stealing money that's Tamasic
Dee 11:03
Which also happens
Vee 11:06
Right right, that is totally tamasic
Dee 11:07
What about happiness?
Vee 11:08
Sattvic people find inner peace. Because their lifestyle is such that they can find joy within them. They don't have to go far. They don't need a lot of things to be happy. They're happy, they're content, they're satisfied.
Now rajasic people find happiness in the senses pleasure. Right? So it is great in the beginning. But you know, what happens is they lose control and they have too much desire
Dee 11:33
and also it’s temporary, right?
Vee 11:35
Yes, it’s temporary. So let's give an example. Somebody who's looking for a job, they get a great job. It's paying well six figure salary, they're happy, very happy, of course, right? But that happiness is short lived. So either they want more, or the job they're not finding meaning or purpose and comes with a lot of stress and bitterness, politics, a lot of different things, right. So the same job the salary that made you happy a couple of months ago, is not leading to the same level of happiness and it actually drops significantly. Right? So rajasic happiness is driven by materialistic pleasure. And like we said, it's very short-lived. Now tamasic happiness draws pleasure from sleep, laziness and intoxication.
Dee 12:20
Yeah, we all went through that happiness.
Vee 12:22
Oh, yeah
Dee 12:23
Tamasic happiness of course, um, how about intelligence?
Vee 12:27
So Sattvic intellect, people are very clear. They know what is right. They know what is wrong. There is no confusion. example. Let's go back to the Mahabharata. Yudhisthira was of the Sattvic intellect, who is very clear. He had a good understanding of dharma. He knew this is dharma. And this is adharma
Dee 12:45
He was very clear
Vee 12:46
Very clear. He had no doubt .. it was pretty clear ..there was no gray area.
Dee 12:48
So Yoda from Star Wars is Sattvic?
Vee 12:50
very very Sattvic. He was green in color and white but for Him He will make a special exception. Yeah Sattvic.
Rajasic intellect is like Arjuna
Dee 13:01
At least in the beginning..
Vee 13:03
Yes .. before the Bhagavad Gita, right? They are always confused. They don't know what is right and what is wrong. They're not bad people, but they are just confused. Dharma and adharma is not clearly understood to them, and they're looking for advice. And that's why the whole Gita happened.
Tamasic people, I would say, Duryodhana - the best example. And their intelligence is covered by either ignorance, arrogance or both. And they are so determined that they think their adharma is dharma because they want to justify it in their own mind, and they don't have an understanding of pretty much anything. Right? To give you an example, I'm going to talk about religion
Dee 13:39
WOW - at last.
Vee 13:42
A lot of people say religion has done a great .. good things, but religion can be pretty bad, right? Yeah, a lot of Tamasic people have made religion pretty horrible. Look at just the history not even 5000 years ago, a few hundred years. So many people have done so such vile Horrible, disgusting things and justified it in the name of religion. They say it's good because it is a true religion. This is the true God. And people kill each other because you don't believe in that God ..they kill because they say it is Dharma. They kill in the name of God, and it's totally tamasic. And that is not religion, you're just forcing yourself to believe that it is Dharma. And it is actually not.
Dee 14:24
So what about leading our life in our way?
Vee 14:27
Oh, sure. I think you should, if you want to lead your life and you know, you don't want to follow any authority or any organization. That is absolutely fine. And actually Krishna makes a great point. He says, first find out who you are. So first thing is be mindful of who you are. And if your goal to find this path can lead you to happiness and inner peace, then at some time, you have to adopt some degree of Sattvic mindset. So it is technically a journey. And it comes from pretty much awareness and the life choices you make.
Dee 15:00
When you spoke about the life choices and the journey, it reminded me of the movie Guide.
Vee 15:07
Oh, that's a nice old movie. Go on
Dee 15:09
Yeah yeah ..It's a really great book written by R K Narayan. It has an enlightening story about a journey of a man who is in the beginning. He's kind of selfish, he is greedy. He’s kind of mind manipulative, and how this man ends up becoming a realized soul.
Dev Anand plays the role of this charismatic character Raju, who is a tourist guide, okay. And you know, as a tourist guide, he meets Rosie, who's a very young and beautiful wife of one guy, Marco okay. And Raju betrays Marco by starting an affair with Rosie and Rosie leaves Marco and starts living with Raju. Okay, so Raju knows this woman is an excellent dancer. So he takes up the role of a professional guide by managing her career as a dancer
Vee 16:03
Okay, okay.
Dee 16:04
So Rosie, she becomes the most sought after star in town. Okay, and using Rosie’s stardom Raju now you know, he is in pursuit of money and prestige, all these things ..he enjoys that until one day he's convicted of forgery. He goes to prison for two years.
Vee 16:24
Oh, right.
Dee 16:25
So after two years when Raju is released from ..from the prison, now he does not want to return to his city
Vee 16:32
Old life
Dee: 16:33
Old life.. He chooses to wander around in poverty, hunger and loneliness. But you know, what happens is one day he's just walking around. He meets a group of Yogis and he spends a night at a temple with these Yogis near a village. And the next morning these Yogis leave him there ..he is still slipping, but before they go, these Yogis ..they just cover the sleeping Raju with that, you know, religious orange colored shawl
Vee 17:01
Yeah.
Dee 17:02
And what happens is like one of the villagers ..he sees Raju in a temple and that ,, because he's wearing that shawl, the villager assumes that this is .. some holy man has reached the village
Vee 17:16
right right
Dee 17:17
Now Raju is a very smart man with ..you know intelligence and wit. So he manages to fool the naive villagers that he is indeed a spiritual guru and the villagers enjoy his guidance and in return Raju enjoys the luxury of being a holy man as the villagers feed him for free, give him a place to stay and really respect him.
So things are going all fine for Raju until drought hits the village
Vee 17:40
Okay
Dee 17:41
And the villagers believe that it's you know, for holy spiritual man like Raju fast for 12 days, they will get rain from the gods. Okay. Now Raju is reluctant because this is not.. he is a Dhongi Baba ..he was just pretending to be a spiritual guru. And he actually tries to run away from there. But somehow he fails. Now he has no option but to undertake this fast. Meanwhile, you know interestingly remember Rosie finds him and she comes to the village and she tells him to return with her - indicating now money, wife prestige, everything is waiting.
Vee 18:19
So she's ready to forgive and accept him?
Dee 18:22
Umm…in one way is he has an option to betray those gullible villagers. But at this point, he realizes that he must live up to the villages trust in him
Vee 18:34
Good.
Dee 18:35
So he submits to the two week fast subjecting himself to great sacrifice right and he risked his life in the process. So for the first time in his life, Raju's motives are not driven by pure self interest, right instead he really wants to do good for the villages. That’s his Sattvic moment, I guess, but he dies in the movie. But before his death, he feels the rain rising in his body. I think he sees his own soul and he sees something inside his body. He might be hallucinating because he's hungry and he is dying. But the image that he sees kind of suggest Raju's spiritual awakening, and that is Moksha or liberation, as Krishna suggests
Vee19:16
So that is technically his Sattvic moment. It is also said that you actually see your soul when you are in the Sattvic. Yeah, so that could be what they were trying to portray.
Dee 19:26
So what's the mantra for today? And how do you want to summarize …summarize it?
Vee 19:30
Okay. So before we get to the mantra, let me say, you know what Krishna says In the end, he basically says, “I have now revealed to you this wisdom, which is the Deepest mystery. After fully considering what you have heard, you should then act as you see fit.”
Dee 19:49
Don't you love it?
Vee 19:50
Love it, love it. he does not force Arjuna. And he doesn't say no. See, I showed you before that I'm God and do what I say ..No, he doesn't say. He says think about what I told you about all the wisdom I've given. Consider it, and you must follow it based on what is appropriate for you. Good, right. So the mantra now is you cannot just read the Bhagavad Gita or any of the, you know, self help books or any philosophy books, and talk about the philosophy without acting on it and leading a lifestyle that reflects what you have learned. Right? It's easy to talk a big game, you can talk about anything. Yeah. Right. But you should be prepared to act on it. Mm hmm. Anyway, what is your biggest takeaway from the Bhagavad Gita and the 10 podcasts that we have done? This is number 10.
Dee 20:36
Yeah, I think my biggest takeaway from the Gita is have patience. You know, that is something I should work on. Have patience, be consistent, and run away from instant gratification? Because nothing comes for free,
Vee 20:51
and nothing comes instantly.
Dee 20:52
Nothing comes instantly. You know, there are days when you succeed, and there are days when you fail. I guess like don’t get influenced or carried away by short term successes or failures. You know, you should keep going and not give up. I know it sounds very cliché, but you know, it's… it's very powerful to me. Once you start ..anything. Finish it. Like we are finishing our podcast on Gita today.
Vee 21:17
HOOOO
Dee 21:17
How do you feel?
Vee 21:18
Great. Great Awesome. Awesome. And as I mentioned, this is podcast number 10 of season one. And technically we are going to wrap up the Bhagwad Gita portion of it. But we want to add two more episodes about Patanjali Yoga sutras and wrap it up in Episode 12 for season one, right, because it also has a lot of practical applications on life. Anyway, thank you, everyone for listening to our podcast these last few months. Yes. Thank you.